[CS-FSLUG] OT: THE EU VOTE....GOOD article.

[Raphaël Pinson]

It would be so great if most american began with getting informations about 
what really happens in the rest of the world before writing such stupid 
things...


Le Jeudi 2 Juin 2005 21:23, Fred A. Miller a écrit :

> THE EU VOTE
>
>          The voters in France have rejected proposed changes in the
> constitution of the European Union.

First off, this text was not a constitution, but a treaty for the institution 
of a Constitution. Secondly, it is not about changes in the constitution, 
since there has never been a constitution in Europe in the past. Europe is a 
reunion of countries, not a federal country. The idea of a constitution is 
new and this didn't deal with changes but with the establishment of the first 
constitution of Europe ever.

> What does this mean for the future of 
> Europe?  It is very significant because all twenty-five of the current
> members of EU must ratify the new constitution in order for it to be
> adopted. 

Again this is not a new constitution, but a text proposing a work on A 
constitution, the first one ever in history.

> Nine countries have already done so: Austria, Germany, Greece, 
> Hungary, Italy, Lithuania, Slovakia, Slovenia and Spain.  US news services
> are reporting that the people of the Netherlands have rejected it by more
> than 60%!

I don't know what we would do without the US news services ;)

> The referendum is nonbinding, but Dutch leaders have pledged to 
> accept it, so long as the result is clear and turnout is above 30%.   Parts
> of the proposal are said to be changes that can take place without popular
> referendum, and those may take place anyway, but the main changes in voting
> procedures which were thought to be necessary to prevent deadlock appear to
> be lost.   What considerations drove the vote?    Initially, many
> commentators were blaming the unpopularity of the governments of France and
> the Netherlands, but since the vote  more thoughtful evaluations are
> emerging.

The main reason that drove the French to vote against this text was that most 
people don't see what Europe is bringing them anymore. Furthermore, it is 
true that lots of them voted against the governement. They are not happy with 
our government and the government made a huge advertising in favor of the 
constitution. Thus the results. I personally don't like it that people mixed 
european stuff with national ones, but this is what happened, in France as in 
the Netherlands. I don't base myself on the US news service... I live in 
France and we have been talking about that enough with lots of people lately 
so I know what people think and why they would vote against or for it.

>
>          Some of the voting may have been emotional.  Politicians usually
> preach acceptance of all religions and cultures because it promotes peace
> and stability and is helpful to business interests. But the Muslim 
> religion and culture is objectionable to those who oppose the subjugation
> of women, (They are less than property in many Arab countries.) genital
> mutilation, tolerance of multiple wives, religious encouragement of a high
> birth rate, and government by clerics. 

This is not true. And I might remind some how bad the laws used to be in 
European countries when it was governed by clerics, some centuries ago...

> But we must not say this in public 
> or to flush the Koran down the toilet!

Don't worry, some policitians don't hesitate to say such things in public! 
There are more and more nationalists in Europe...

> (Some aspects of Western culture 
> are not admirable either.)  There is a huge Muslim population in France,
> and the French and the Dutch see the Muslim incursion as a challenge to
> their culture, a threat to their way of life.

There have been muslims for more than 50 years in France (not to say big parts 
of the country have been part of muslim empires some centuries ago, and have 
kept it in their cultures). Some parts of the arabic culture have even become 
part of the French culture so much that we forgot it was arabic (esp. food). 

> Many voters may also have 
> considered the fact that Turkey, ninety percent Muslim, has an application
> pending to join the EU,  and they may have believed acceptance would mean
> even more jobs lost.

Although Turkey is composed of a huge population of Muslim, I find it the 
funniest thing to say things like "Turkey doesn't have Christian roots as we 
do". Remind me where were the first Christian communities founded? Ephesia, 
Phillipa, Corinthia ... where is this now ? Did Paul ever evangelise France 
or the Netherlands (France was a Roman province too at the time, since 52 
BC). Most politicians who blame Turkey for not being Christian are not 
Christian themselves, just like GWB who talks so more about Christianity is 
not a Christian imo. Often in history non-christians try to *control* 
Christians by making them think they are focused on their interests...

> And then, there is the reality of ethnic ghettos, the 
> well-known case of the  assassination of a prominent politician in Holland
> by a radical Islamic Muslim, a general increase in the crime rates, a
> failure of the immigrants to inter-marry and adopt the culture of their new
> environment, and the intense competition for jobs. 

Ghetto is a term that fits the american reality, not the european one. We 
don't have ghettos, as in black people somewhere, arabic elsewhere, latinos 
in a third place, etc. We have rich and poor places for sure, but it's not as 
harsh a separation as in the US.
Intense competition for jobs ... LOL ... France had muslims come here years 
ago to help us for the war, when some muslim countries were still part of our 
country. They fought in our army, and now we would consider they steal our 
jobs? One has to be really bad to think this way, when these people didn't 
ask to come.

> Unemployment in France 
> is now about ten percent, and many  Frenchmen blame immigrants from Eastern
> Europe and North Africa.

This is true, although it's very stupid. Most people from Eastern Europe and 
North Africa do jobs that the French don't want to do, and wouldn't do if 
they were proposed to. In most countries, people still have to understand 
that you don't get a job by waiting for it to come. 

> What the Europeans have been doing with their 
> Union, the United States has been doing with porous  borders and trade
> agreements.  All of these policies are designed to take advantage of cheap
> labor.  Massive immigration of foreign people into any country is
> understandably unpopular, and no thinking person should be surprised by
> this vote.  Why can't Americans vote directly on these questions?   (Is
> Europe more democratic than the United States?)

Is this really a question ? Honestly the american "democracy" is so shocking 
for us that we don't wonder anymore if Europe is more democratic than the 
US...

> The US government would 
> never permit such a referendum because the "non" vote would be
> overwhelming. 

The principle of a democracy in my opinion is that the people are able to 
express themselves. If the governement if sanctionned by this vote, then it 
means the governement is not good and has to be replaced, since the people 
are not happy with it.

> The very concept of the world's system of nation-states is 
> based on territorial protection.  It is a basic form of self-defense,  an
> innate trait of humankind.
>

I don't really mind that the US are not really democratic as long as it stays 
inside their country. What I mind more is that they seem to always think they 
know what is good for others in their place. If they can't keep a democracy 
inside their own country, they'd better not think about helping people set 
one.

Sorry for all this, but I couldn't let such a false info go on...

Raphaël


------------------------------------
Raphaël Pinson - raphink at ichthux.org
http://raphink.multiply.com
http://www.ichthux.org - Christian Linux Distribution
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