[CS-FSLUG] A couple of thoughts on denominations

[Don Parris]

On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 00:29:10 -0500, Ed Hurst <softedges at tconline.net> wrote:
> Don Parris wrote:
> > While I would disagree with the Lutherans on transubstantiation, I
> > also consider myself very much united with them "in Christ".  I tend
> > to be a bit more open than you, Ed, probably because of my upbringing.
> >  The Christian Church, Disciples of Christ, started out as an attempt
> > to "not be a denomination", but a movement to break down
> > denominational walls.  My understanding is that a Presbyterian and a
> > Methodist started the whole thing.  Their creed is "no creed but
> > Christ".  But they didn't throw out the baby with the bathwater,
> > either.
> >
> > I'm not a part of that denomination now, mainly due to God's calling on my life.
> 
> God's calling is precisely the one reason you can give for that.
> 
> I was brought up to give folks as much room as they needed to be
> themselves, and work with anyone I could. I've been excluded from a
> half-dozen churches, actually kicked out of two. I've fled at least that
> many. The NATO chapel in the Netherlands was pretty decent, because they
> were tolerant of varied convictions.
> 
To some extent, you sound like my Dad.  He's always allowed people to
be who they are - that's why he's so widely respected in his neck of
the woods (WV).  The So. Bapt. preacher in our network tells us he's
always preached in the top 10% of SBC churches.  I believe he got run
out of his last church on something stupid, as well.  And it was a
church he had planted.

> Opinions we hold; convictions hold us. They concern things eternal. They
> matter on the ultimate level. If I am wrong on convictions, I am in deep
> trouble, and there is no hope for me, because only God Himself can
> change them.
> 
Well, um, if God can change your views, then there _is_ still hope. :)

> When I fled a church, it was usually because they demanded I stop doing
> something I was called by God to do. For example, one church demanded I
> stop getting down in the floor and playing with the little kids. Another
> told me I must stop "frightening" the teenagers by directly challenging
> their popular silly notions about life.
> 
> Sometimes it was because I dared to teach a conviction. Example: for
> many years, I was eclectic about Bible translations. Then, over the past
> decade, after a lot of study, I was forced to conclude that the KJV and
> NKJV were closer to the orignials. I never once considered any
> "enforcement" of that on others, just dared to teach it.
> 
My brother was visiting the DOC regional minister in Charleston, WV
once, As another preacher was getting ready to leave the office, he
showed his pistol under his blazer.  Apparently he had obtained
permission to carry it, as his congregation had threatened to kill him
& his family if they didn't get out of town pretty quick.  The
preacher was from the Southern part of the state, which is well-known
for its, umm, shalll we say, "rugged" lifestyle?

I've also read the book, Mississippi: the Closed Society.  The author
writes of preachers who tried to preach brotherly love in the
50's-60's.  I can imagine some of the things preachers get run out
for.

> My personal conversion experience taught me that I could not possibly
> have chosen God; He chose me. I didn't save me, and I'm certain I can't
> lose me. Folks at the NATO chapel with different convictions understood
> that, and went on. OTOH, one church told me I could never, ever teach
> again inside their walls.
> 
> This ignores all the silly things like how I dress, or something equally
> superficial. I have a medical condition on my skin, so I refuse to shave
> for anybody. Three churches excluded me. I don't own a suit, because I'm
> extremely hard to fit, and it costs an obscene amount; off-the-rack
> doesn't exist for this body and this budget. God only knows how many
> choked on that.
> 
The preacher that married my brother and his wife is a clown.  I can
just imagine how he would fare in some SBC churches.  He's Methodist.

> Organized religion remains a circus. When you get away from
> institutional religion, things are pretty smooth. I fellowship all sorts
> of folks, because that's what matters. As soon as someone attempts to
> organize the activity, rules *must* appear or we can't call it
> "organization." I am always one of the first to suffer from rules. You
> won't see me begging for more rules. My calling is to the oddballs and
> nut cases, the weirdos and flakes. By no means do I present myself as
> any of those things, at least not consciously.
> 
Hey, somebody's gotta love 'em. :)

> For now, Southern Baptists tolerate me. They ordained me 20 years ago.
> No other group wants me, as far as I know. I assure I've checked often.
> There is a known quantity of issues that confront me in SBC
> congregations, for the most part. I am called by God to change location
> from time to time, and if I had to start from scratch with each location
> because there are no usable labels to save me time, I'd probably suffer
> several false starts after each move. The Lord does not habitually point
> me to this or that place of worship. I check the SBCs firsts, or the
> closest thing in a given area. If they make me feel unwelcome, I have a
> mental list of other labels I can check, because I know what is likely
> under each one.
> 
> Without those handy labels, I might waste a year or more looking for a
> congregation that can tolerate me, because the process of meaningful
> acquaintance is rather slow. Because there are labels, I have a chance
> to begin serving rather quickly. I cannot possibly consider simply
> attending without actively leading sometime soon. Passive membership
> would be unfaithfulness to my calling.
> 
Lately, it seems my FOSS ministry has had far more impact than my
local discipleship ministry.  I definitely understand much of it now. 
Still, it has made for some very frustrating times.  The FOSS ministry
is something I can point to and say that I have been effective for Him
in this area.  Naturally, I'm working on expanding that.

It's good to get to know you, Ed.  I get more conversation from you
than from most of the ministers here in Charlotte.  This is a rough
town to make friends in for some reason.  I keep hearing something
about the competitive spirit among the pastors.  I keep expecting to
see a church that rivals the Bank of America tower any day now.

Don

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